Iris and Gmail

[Robert Werry]

Since updating to the latest version of Iris (Jan 22), I can no long
open the Standard HTML Gmail window, which worked fine before. No
great problem as the Basic HTML version still works. Just curious as
to whether anyone else has noticed this.

[David Pitt]

Post by Robert Werry
Since updating to the latest version of Iris (Jan 22), I can no long
open the Standard HTML Gmail window, which worked fine before. No
great problem as the Basic HTML version still works. Just curious as
to whether anyone else has noticed this.

I do not use gmail but I did notice that on the Titanium on upgrading to the
latest Iris (22 Jan) that some sites were no longer reachable, a conveinient
example being TechRadar from the home page. Sometime later I noticed that on
the RPi400 with the same version os Iris that the TechRadar site was
reachable.

The issue is the ZeroPain module which was only in use on the Titanium.
Removing it allows the TechRadar site to load.

Conversely loading ZeroPain on the RPi400 does stop TechRadar.

This may or may not help with gmail.

[Robert Werry]

Post by David Pitt

Post by Robert Werry
Since updating to the latest version of Iris (Jan 22), I can no long
open the Standard HTML Gmail window, which worked fine before. No
great problem as the Basic HTML version still works. Just curious as
to whether anyone else has noticed this.

I do not use gmail but I did notice that on the Titanium on upgrading to the
latest Iris (22 Jan) that some sites were no longer reachable, a conveinient
example being TechRadar from the home page. Sometime later I noticed that on
the RPi400 with the same version os Iris that the TechRadar site was
reachable.
The issue is the ZeroPain module which was only in use on the Titanium.
Removing it allows the TechRadar site to load.
Conversely loading ZeroPain on the RPi400 does stop TechRadar.
This may or may not help with gmail.

Thanks for your reply, David.

Rpi 4, here, with RISC OS 5.28. I do not appear to have the ZeroPain
module, and TechRadar loads fine, so not the issue in my case, but
very much appreciate your thoughts.

[Chris Hughes]

Post by Robert Werry

Post by David Pitt

Post by Robert Werry
Since updating to the latest version of Iris (Jan 22), I can no long
open the Standard HTML Gmail window, which worked fine before. No
great problem as the Basic HTML version still works. Just curious as
to whether anyone else has noticed this.

I do not use gmail but I did notice that on the Titanium on upgrading to the
latest Iris (22 Jan) that some sites were no longer reachable, a conveinient
example being TechRadar from the home page. Sometime later I noticed that on
the RPi400 with the same version os Iris that the TechRadar site was
reachable.
The issue is the ZeroPain module which was only in use on the Titanium.
Removing it allows the TechRadar site to load.
Conversely loading ZeroPain on the RPi400 does stop TechRadar.
This may or may not help with gmail.

Thanks for your reply, David.
Rpi 4, here, with RISC OS 5.28. I do not appear to have the ZeroPain
module, and TechRadar loads fine, so not the issue in my case, but
very much appreciate your thoughts.

I can get into the basic Gmail webmail, but access to the 'standard'
version is not currently working. Google issues a warning you are using an
out of date version of Chrome and wants you to update it! I have not yet
tried using a different User Agent to try and get round this.

Google recently announced a major "update" to how Gmail worked as of about
10 days ago. Its partly to do with the big changes they are rolling out to
those with G-Suite

[Robert Werry]

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Robert Werry

Post by David Pitt

Post by Robert Werry
Since updating to the latest version of Iris (Jan 22), I can no long
open the Standard HTML Gmail window, which worked fine before. No
great problem as the Basic HTML version still works. Just curious as
to whether anyone else has noticed this.

I do not use gmail but I did notice that on the Titanium on upgrading to the
latest Iris (22 Jan) that some sites were no longer reachable, a conveinient
example being TechRadar from the home page. Sometime later I noticed that on
the RPi400 with the same version os Iris that the TechRadar site was
reachable.
The issue is the ZeroPain module which was only in use on the Titanium.
Removing it allows the TechRadar site to load.
Conversely loading ZeroPain on the RPi400 does stop TechRadar.
This may or may not help with gmail.

Thanks for your reply, David.
Rpi 4, here, with RISC OS 5.28. I do not appear to have the ZeroPain
module, and TechRadar loads fine, so not the issue in my case, but
very much appreciate your thoughts.

I can get into the basic Gmail webmail, but access to the 'standard'
version is not currently working. Google issues a warning you are using an
out of date version of Chrome and wants you to update it! I have not yet
tried using a different User Agent to try and get round this.
Google recently announced a major "update" to how Gmail worked as of about
10 days ago. Its partly to do with the big changes they are rolling out to
those with G-Suite

This makes sense. It would be about ten days ago that I installed the
Jan 22 Iris update. How coincidental! Basic Gmail working fine but
standard hanging on startup screen.

I've now had a play with different User Agents in Iris, but to no
avail.

Thanks for the insight, Chris.

[Chris Hughes]

Post by Robert Werry

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Robert Werry

Post by David Pitt

Post by Robert Werry
Since updating to the latest version of Iris (Jan 22), I can no long
open the Standard HTML Gmail window, which worked fine before. No
great problem as the Basic HTML version still works. Just curious as
to whether anyone else has noticed this.

I do not use gmail but I did notice that on the Titanium on upgrading to the
latest Iris (22 Jan) that some sites were no longer reachable, a conveinient
example being TechRadar from the home page. Sometime later I noticed that on
the RPi400 with the same version os Iris that the TechRadar site was
reachable.
The issue is the ZeroPain module which was only in use on the Titanium.
Removing it allows the TechRadar site to load.
Conversely loading ZeroPain on the RPi400 does stop TechRadar.
This may or may not help with gmail.

Thanks for your reply, David.
Rpi 4, here, with RISC OS 5.28. I do not appear to have the ZeroPain
module, and TechRadar loads fine, so not the issue in my case, but
very much appreciate your thoughts.

I can get into the basic Gmail webmail, but access to the 'standard'
version is not currently working. Google issues a warning you are using an
out of date version of Chrome and wants you to update it! I have not yet
tried using a different User Agent to try and get round this.
Google recently announced a major "update" to how Gmail worked as of about
10 days ago. Its partly to do with the big changes they are rolling out to
those with G-Suite

This makes sense. It would be about ten days ago that I installed the
Jan 22 Iris update. How coincidental! Basic Gmail working fine but
standard hanging on startup screen.
I've now had a play with different User Agents in Iris, but to no
avail.
Thanks for the insight, Chris.

To be honest I do not use the webmail interface normally anyway. I
download all my gmail emails and send them from Messenger Pro. works
nicely.

[Harriet Bazley]

On 13 Feb 2022 as I do recall,
[snip]

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Robert Werry

Post by Chris Hughes
Google recently announced a major "update" to how Gmail worked as of about
10 days ago. Its partly to do with the big changes they are rolling out to
those with G-Suite

This makes sense. It would be about ten days ago that I installed the
Jan 22 Iris update. How coincidental! Basic Gmail working fine but
standard hanging on startup screen.
I've now had a play with different User Agents in Iris, but to no
avail.
Thanks for the insight, Chris.

To be honest I do not use the webmail interface normally anyway. I
download all my gmail emails and send them from Messenger Pro. works
nicely.

I wonder how much longer MPro will go on working with an 'updated'
Gmail that regards it as insecure, though :-(

[Chris Newman]

Post by Harriet Bazley

Post by Chris Hughes
To be honest I do not use the webmail interface normally anyway. I
download all my gmail emails and send them from Messenger Pro. works
nicely.

I wonder how much longer MPro will go on working with an 'updated'
Gmail that regards it as insecure, though :-(

Just been setting up a new e-address for the Mem Sahib. couldn't get it
to work then Google told me we were using an insecure mail app.

It's Office Outlook 2010 so not much longevity in Microsoft products.

Anyway, Google reminded us that in your account settings you can opt to
"Use less secure apps" or something similar. Did that, ignoring the dire
warnings and all is now well.

[Chris Hughes]

Post by Harriet Bazley
On 13 Feb 2022 as I do recall,
[snip]

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Robert Werry

Post by Chris Hughes
Google recently announced a major "update" to how Gmail worked as of about
10 days ago. Its partly to do with the big changes they are rolling out to
those with G-Suite

This makes sense. It would be about ten days ago that I installed the
Jan 22 Iris update. How coincidental! Basic Gmail working fine but
standard hanging on startup screen.
I've now had a play with different User Agents in Iris, but to no
avail.
Thanks for the insight, Chris.

To be honest I do not use the webmail interface normally anyway. I
download all my gmail emails and send them from Messenger Pro. works
nicely.

I wonder how much longer MPro will go on working with an 'updated'
Gmail that regards it as insecure, though :-(

Webmail based Gmail uses OAuth and soon Oauth2 for secure logins which
have been around for several years but we currently don't support them on
RISC OS yet. We just need NetFetch/Hermes to support it. I very much doubt
Popstar would ever support it.

[Stuart]

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Harriet Bazley
I wonder how much longer MPro will go on working with an 'updated'
Gmail that regards it as insecure, though :-(

Webmail based Gmail uses OAuth and soon Oauth2 for secure logins which
have been around for several years but we currently don't support them
on RISC OS

Never mind, I'm sticking with good old Orpheus for my Email.

[Chris Newman]

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Harriet Bazley
[snip]

Webmail based Gmail uses OAuth and soon Oauth2 for secure logins which
have been around for several years but we currently don't support them
on RISC OS yet. We just need NetFetch/Hermes to support it. I very
much doubt Popstar would ever support it.

I have 6 gmail accounts which work perfectly with PoP using
Netfetch/Hermes/Pluto. If I set Netfetch to leave mail on the server and
ignore previously downloaded items, Ican still access the stuff on
Thunderbird on the dark side. No problem.

[Chris Hughes]

Post by Chris Newman

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Harriet Bazley
[snip]

Webmail based Gmail uses OAuth and soon Oauth2 for secure logins which
have been around for several years but we currently don't support them
on RISC OS yet. We just need NetFetch/Hermes to support it. I very
much doubt Popstar would ever support it.

I have 6 gmail accounts which work perfectly with PoP using
Netfetch/Hermes/Pluto. If I set Netfetch to leave mail on the server and
ignore previously downloaded items, Ican still access the stuff on
Thunderbird on the dark side. No problem.

To be clear we do not yet AFAIK support OAuth or OAuth2 secure logon
protocols as used by the webmail interface.

Yes we can get Gmail mail via POP3 or IMAP via NetFetch/Hermes currently,
but this method is via what Google say are insecure apps (includes
Thurderbird)

[Chris Newman]

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Chris Newman

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Harriet Bazley
[snip]

Webmail based Gmail uses OAuth and soon Oauth2 for secure logins
which have been around for several years but we currently don't
support them on RISC OS yet. We just need NetFetch/Hermes to support
it. I very much doubt Popstar would ever support it.

I have 6 gmail accounts which work perfectly with PoP using
Netfetch/Hermes/Pluto. If I set Netfetch to leave mail on the server
and ignore previously downloaded items, Ican still access the stuff
on Thunderbird on the dark side. No problem.

To be clear we do not yet AFAIK support OAuth or OAuth2 secure logon
protocols as used by the webmail interface.
Yes we can get Gmail mail via POP3 or IMAP via NetFetch/Hermes
currently, but this method is via what Google say are insecure apps
(includes Thurderbird)

See my previous post. You can set you account to ignore that.

[Chris Hughes]

Post by Chris Newman

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Chris Newman

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Harriet Bazley
[snip]

Webmail based Gmail uses OAuth and soon Oauth2 for secure logins
which have been around for several years but we currently don't
support them on RISC OS yet. We just need NetFetch/Hermes to support
it. I very much doubt Popstar would ever support it.

I have 6 gmail accounts which work perfectly with PoP using
Netfetch/Hermes/Pluto. If I set Netfetch to leave mail on the server
and ignore previously downloaded items, Ican still access the stuff
on Thunderbird on the dark side. No problem.

To be clear we do not yet AFAIK support OAuth or OAuth2 secure logon
protocols as used by the webmail interface.
Yes we can get Gmail mail via POP3 or IMAP via NetFetch/Hermes
currently, but this method is via what Google say are insecure apps
(includes Thurderbird)

See my previous post. You can set you account to ignore that.

I know all that ! I was explaining how the webmail service worked and how
we might have to change in the future.

[Chris Newman]

Post by Chris Hughes
I know all that ! I was explaining how the webmail service worked and
how we might have to change in the future.

So are you saying Iris & Netsurf won't be up to it?

[Chris Hughes]

Post by Chris Newman

Post by Chris Hughes
I know all that ! I was explaining how the webmail service worked and
how we might have to change in the future.

So are you saying Iris & Netsurf won't be up to it?

Netsurf - very unlikely
Iris - hopefully will be in the future.

[Chris Hughes]

Post by Chris Newman

Post by Chris Hughes
I know all that ! I was explaining how the webmail service worked and
how we might have to change in the future.

So are you saying Iris & Netsurf won't be up to it?

here is some more info on what Oauth and the newer OAuth2 is and how it
works.

https://www.csoonline.com/article/3216404/what-is-oauth-how-the-open-authorization-framework-works.html

[Harriet Bazley]

(Oops! Unintentionally e-mailed to Chris Hughes instead of posting to
the newsgroup....)
[snip]

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Chris Newman

Post by Chris Hughes
To be clear we do not yet AFAIK support OAuth or OAuth2 secure logon
protocols as used by the webmail interface.
Yes we can get Gmail mail via POP3 or IMAP via NetFetch/Hermes
currently, but this method is via what Google say are insecure apps
(includes Thurderbird)

See my previous post. You can set you account to ignore that.

I know all that ! I was explaining how the webmail service worked and how
we might have to change in the future.

As anticipated, GMail have now sent out a message warning users that in
the near future 'insecure' software like old versions of Outlook will no
longer be allowed to access its services at all - I assume this applies
to MessengerPro and Pluto and their respective mail fetchers too, not to
mention things like AntiSpam....

[charles]

Post by Harriet Bazley
(Oops! Unintentionally e-mailed to Chris Hughes instead of posting to
the newsgroup....)
[snip]

Post by Chris Hughes

Post by Chris Newman

Post by Chris Hughes
To be clear we do not yet AFAIK support OAuth or OAuth2 secure logon
protocols as used by the webmail interface.
Yes we can get Gmail mail via POP3 or IMAP via NetFetch/Hermes
currently, but this method is via what Google say are insecure apps
(includes Thurderbird)

See my previous post. You can set you account to ignore that.

I know all that ! I was explaining how the webmail service worked and
how we might have to change in the future.

As anticipated, GMail have now sent out a message warning users that in
the near future 'insecure' software like old versions of Outlook will no
longer be allowed to access its services at all - I assume this applies
to MessengerPro and Pluto and their respective mail fetchers too, not to
mention things like AntiSpam....

I acces Gmail with Thunderbird. I wonder how that will cope?

[Steve Fryatt]

On 4 Mar, charles wrote in message

Post by charles

Post by Harriet Bazley
As anticipated, GMail have now sent out a message warning users that in
the near future 'insecure' software like old versions of Outlook will no
longer be allowed to access its services at all - I assume this applies
to MessengerPro and Pluto and their respective mail fetchers too, not to
mention things like AntiSpam....

I acces Gmail with Thunderbird. I wonder how that will cope?

Since it appears to support OAuth 2, probably quite well...

That said, doesn't turning on 2-Step Authentication in your Google account
and then creating an "App Password" work? From a very quick investigation,
they appear to walk and quack like the "authentication tokens" that everyone
else is using to replace passwords for things that don't do OAuth.

The idea is that a) they're more secure than "Password1", and b) since you
can create as many as you need (one per application, per computer or other
device), it's trivial to revoke them if they get leaked.

[Nat Queen]

Post by Harriet Bazley
As anticipated, GMail have now sent out a message warning users that in
the near future 'insecure' software like old versions of Outlook will no
longer be allowed to access its services at all - I assume this applies
to MessengerPro and Pluto and their respective mail fetchers too, not to
mention things like AntiSpam....

My mail to gmail.com addresses has been blocked lately. But I found a
simple solution: Simply replace gmail.com in such addresses by
googlemail.com, and the mail is received normally.

I always thought that those two domain names were equivalent, but mail
to them evidently behaves differently.

Nat